📼 Zoom w/ Sojo COO
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Logan M Isaac: hey. Sorry about that.
You haven't been waiting long, have you?
Matt Murphy: No, not too long.
Logan M Isaac: Okay. I I just real, I, yeah. Didn't even notice there was a little popup block on my. Thingy.
Matt Murphy: That's like every day when I use teams. Like some of our team uses teams and I have no idea how to use it, and I'm always leaving people in the waiting room.
Logan M Isaac: Oh yeah. I feel like I should have learned in COVID, but I must just be a slow learner.
Matt Murphy: It's all good. Um, thanks for taking some time to connect.
Logan M Isaac: Yeah, well, I mean, thank you for taking me up on the offer.
Matt Murphy: Tell me, I, I mean, I definitely want to deal with issues at hand, but I'd love to get to know you a little bit better first so that I know who I'm talking to and I can tell you a little about myself as well. Um, I've read some of your articles, so I know some, like You're Combat veteran and then, uh, worked a lot on the, um, the peace movement for veterans, which I [00:01:00] am somewhat aware of from being in the DC area.
But, um. Just curious, kind of like, you know, it's been a decade since you've written with Soja owners where that journey's taken you.
Logan M Isaac: Um, where did the journey take me? Yeah. Um,
uh, I, well I guess the most efficient way to answer that is, um. Yeah. Uh, I got outta the military and a lot of progressives really liked the fact that I said I wouldn't deploy with a weapon, right? I didn't ask for discharge, which made a lot of conservatives like it, and that's been something that, uh, I'm pretty proud of.
Matt Murphy: Yeah.
Logan M Isaac: Um, I was actually thinking about this the other day. Yeah, when I, I read the nine 11 commission report and the [00:02:00] Complete Idiots Guide to the Life of Christ on my deployment in oh four. The, the thing I wanted most, or that it left with me was that I didn't want to be a hypocrite. I don't wanna waste my time trying to lie to myself, um, about who or what I was or why, and I was, uh, fuck.
These are all scratched up. I was an artillery man, not like service. So it was like, uh, I need to figure this out. And I had been in five years and I read Yoder and Tolstoy and, um, most of the rest I studied with Stanley Haras. Um, but it never, I know, um, I. I began to find satisfaction in some questions. I had been asking other questions that came up.
Were, were off limits to progressives. Sure. They're off limits in general. Um, and so very early [00:03:00] on I found Martin of Tours. Yep. Right there. Um, and uh, in 19 I took vows as a hospitality of St. Martin, which was really nice. And I'm working on our annual, annual gathering. Um, and Martin, the progressives want to believe in his biography.
Written by an aristocrat who was embarrassed by military service as a lot of progressives are. Um, he kind of like flubbed the numbers to make it look like Martin was only in a few years. Sure. But he didn't, he didn't quite hide the facts enough. Um. And for him to, for Martin 12, only been in a couple years when he goes to battle and he tells Caesar Julian, uh, uh, I'm a Christian soldier.
It's, I'm not allowed to fight. Um, that was the Battle of Vers, which is now Strausberg, which was in 3 56. And so if he enlisted or if he was born in three 16, he didn't get out until he was 40 years [00:04:00] old.
Matt Murphy: Yeah.
Logan M Isaac: Uh, he did full 25 year term and as a pretorian Guardsman, it is, it is plausible for him to have never seen frontline premeditated, violent combat.
It's plausible. Yeah. And so that story might be that he protected a man's life for 20 some odd years before that man, or that position took him to combat and he's like, wait, this is different. In English speaking countries. That's what Martin is known for, is splitting his coat, coat cape. Yeah. It's where we get, uh, chapel, chaplain, acapella, all these things.
Right. Um, but in European nations, uh, he's known for his Bishop Rick. He gets out of the military. And he, uh, goes to find the heavy hitter of his day, Hillary of Poitier. And Hillary was this rabid anti-imperialist, and Hillary wanted to ordain him. And [00:05:00] Martin's like, no, I've, I've shed blood. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna be a priest.
So he is made a deacon, or he's, it's an exorcist, but it's a deacon. Um, and as this itinerant deacon, he goes around forming communities, smashing idols and shit, and. Uh, he's so popular among the country. The, the rural uncivilized pagans and pagans are just, it's uncivilized. It's not a religious term. Yeah.
There's no such thing in Rome as like a pagan religion. It's like, there's the Roman religion and then there's pagan religion. And so these country bumpkins really take a liking to him and he gets really popular. And so the, the people of tour this huge city. Um, want him as their bishop. I don't know why.
Maybe they, I don't know. But they know he doesn't like big cities and he had been known to embarrass Caesar in his own house. Another Caesar that he, uh, later, uh, the Empress. Uh, [00:06:00] Maxim's wife. He catechized an empress. Uh, an empress. Yeah. And so he is really, he kept his ties with the po political class and maybe that's why tours wanted him.
Sure. So they didn't want him escaping. And at the time, to make someone bishop, you just all had to like publicly acclaim someone bishop. And so they conspire, uh, they hatch this plan and they have one of their allies in the country say, oh. My wife or my mother, she's sick. We, we need you to go into the city to cure her.
And Martin's like, okay. Okay. And, uh, along the road from, I think it's K or um, they had placed people in the event of him turning back, they were gonna like drag him into the city center. Right. Because ordination was very different back in the day. Like Pius who started the, uh, tic monasticism or restarted it, um, he caught word that Athanasius of, [00:07:00] of, uh, Athanasius, no.
Ambrose of Milan was coming to his, his area. And he like hid, he had his monks hide him because all he had to do to be made a bishop was to be placed hands upon. Anyway. So Martin is going in and, uh, they, um. They're getting ready to acclaim, and Bishop and the other bishops are there, and they're required.
They're the ones that have to lay hands on him. Mm-hmm. And the other bishops are like, not too happy about this. They're like, he doesn't smell, he smells funny. He doesn't dress right. Um, but they, they succeed in making him bishop and instead of living in the cathedral, um, he insists on living across the river lore in a bunch of caves.
He's the first. Uh, certainly the western first western bishop to adopt and maintain a monastic lifestyle. He had 80 disciples by the time he died, um, and before he died, um. He got involved in the ilion affair, the first heretic that was murdered by the church in order to enforce or enforce [00:08:00] orthodoxy. And because of his connections, he um, he pled to the emperor maxim like, don't do this.
This is not your fight. This is a church misunderstanding, and blah, blah, blah. And Maxim Ian owed him something and he tried to like appease Martin. But ultimately, these Spanish bishops prevailed in having Ilian murdered. And this was in the three, three seventies, three eighties. And he dies in 3 91 or 3 97, I can't remember.
Okay. But he dies thinking he's a failure. Um, and if you go through Europe, Martin's stuff is all over the place. Germany, France, Italy. But here all we think of him as a, as a conscience of objector. Sure. So I mentioned him because he's kind of in this in-between place. He doesn't belong to the Catholic church there, there wasn't a Catholic church before the schism.
Matt Murphy: Right. Um.
Logan M Isaac: And he recognized that there's a certain amount of moral consideration and combat and, and military service and [00:09:00] that level of distinction I haven't found in our, in our church of our day.
Matt Murphy: Yeah.
Logan M Isaac: Um, and Sojourners I noticed published almost anything I gave them until Kathleen Fasani. Um, and the last thing I did write was the silent betrayal of our veterans.
On Martin's Feast Day, April 4th. Yeah. Martin Martin Luther King's Feast Day. Um, and that's because I noticed stuff when I started looking and I started trusting my own experience and my own training, uh, and, um, not adopting the expectations of progressives or conservatives, but progressives. It was, you know, I had to self flagellate and, um, talk about myself in order to.
Be put in front of the parade to borrow my credibility, but never actually invest in who I was and who I was becoming as I [00:10:00] matured theologically. Um, Shane, I noticed at first with Shane. Well, no, I was, it was kind of whole mix of stuff. Um, people and institutions with perceived power kept me at, at arms distance.
Uh, I can prove that to you with the emails with Sojourners, but I'll just take, I'll just believe you, believe me. Um, and that's a little undignified. Um, Shane, it was easier to see. I, I was at his wedding. We went to Iraq together. Um, like I've, I've met his mom on several occasions and I only found out after the fact that he was forming Red Letter Christians and he didn't want me on the leadership team, and that is absolutely his right.
But that. That kind of, that communicates something. Hmm. Um, even when I was at Sojourner's Christian Peace Witness for Iraq in March of 2007. I was invited to read another Veteran's Words simply because he wasn't [00:11:00] available. Joshua Casteel, who died of cancer in 2012, shortly after my first book came out and Sojourner organized it.
I spoke in the National Cathedral before I think 3000 people, but it wasn't my words. I spoke, it was someone else's. Yeah, it was a veteran that progressives could swallow a little bit more easily. So, um, when it became clear to me that people were putting up walls, that's fine. It happened that we, uh, it just happened at Duke as well, Stanley, how Haurewas, um, threatened me and engaged in a quid pro quo.
It only didn't go viral because it had nothing to do with genitalia because we're still all just mannequins. We only really give a shit. If, uh, if our bodies and a perception of bodies are involved, right. Stanley had power. He used that power to shut me down and everybody was fine with it. In fact, they accused me of trying to destroy Stanley.
Yeah. Um, [00:12:00] and so I found my own path and that path is leading me in directions that I don't see progressives willing to go. Uh, but I'm convinced that that is where God is, was and shall be. Um, and. I think this is a time more than any, where our political ideologies need to crank the volume down.
Unfortunately, we're kind of cranking them up. Um, and, uh, I, uh, when did, um, I began asking. Sours is not the only organization I've asked to take my work down, and I've done so because my community, military community, uh, credibility can be the difference between life and death. I don't mean suicides. I mean, sure.
Yeah, I know. Understand your platoon is all you have.
Matt Murphy: Yeah.
Logan M Isaac: And at a suicide rate, that hasn't gone down since I started writing for Sojourners or anybody else. We're doing [00:13:00] something wrong. And if everybody else has the privilege of being divorced from that fact, fine. Uh, but I'm trying something different and I cannot be associated with Sojourner if it's more important to Sojourner to be progressive than to be faithful.
Um, Jim Wall, I asked Sojourner years ago for Jim Wallace to, uh, speak up and say some stuff, and then when he said something opposite, that's when FALs said. Oh, I'm just an angry veteran and I stopped writing. Um, Adam Taylor has been CC'd on this stuff because I spoke with him, uh, when I was getting ready to write my first or second book.
Um, but I can't shake the feeling. I'm just not a part of the cool kid group. But if that's the case, that's fine. I'll go find my own group. But I need a, to not compete with my own writing on other sites. And b, I can't be associated with organizations that are clearly that who, for whom their priorities reflect.
More [00:14:00] fidelity to progressive a, a progressive construct than, uh, I'll say little p progressive values. My, my friends are dying. I don't have time for, um, whatever it is that other organizations and people are doing. Do it. I fought for six years for your right to do it. Um, but that means I know my rights. I want my work down, uh, if it hasn't been paid for.
The good news is I found that, um. The wrestling with demons and the right to refuse to bear arms, those were both paid for. The only one that remains unpaid for is, um, the state and the union, which I don't think I was ever informed with in the magazine. Um, so that's good news. Um, I do still stand by, um, at least my current, uh, interpretation that.
Wrestling with demons was changed so significantly that it doesn't reflect my work. And it was [00:15:00] essentially rejected. Um, and I raised that issue. I, I raised two issues. One was the use of my face without any notification in the magazine, um, which affects my audience. And a second was the fact that instead of me doing work journalistic type work, it was made just into another autobiographical.
Diatribe and my community doesn't take too kindly to talking about yourself all the time. Um, I didn't have that kind of language then. Sure. But that's, that's the case. Um, my work was rejected in order to just make it another sob story for vets or a sob story by a veteran for civilian saviors. Um, and I'm not the only vet that has expressed that.
Um, but I mean, it's, it's out there now. So that's where I'm coming from.
Matt Murphy: That's good language. Gimme one. I just wanna write that phrase. You just sit down because it's really good.[00:16:00]
Um, yeah, I mean, I'm not gonna attempt to justify conversations that you had with people that are long before I worked for so or so. I can't, can't speak into what their motivation is or was and, um. I am dis you know, disappointed that you have had the experience that you've had or that it's led to these feelings.
Um, yeah, I, I don't, yeah, I don't, I don't know. Um, I don't know all the pieces of conversation that you had with Rose and Christine and whoever else who might have been with the staff prior. Excuse me. Um, and I don't wanna, I don't want to, um. I don't wanna take the blame for things that they've said or try to justify something that they said without being a part of that conversation.
[00:17:00] Um, I'm
trying to think of the right word. I am,
I don't believe that Sojourner is, um. Exclusively taking this, we're gonna align with Progressive's mentality, um, that you've, you've stated, I understand how, especially in the area of your content where that can be, um, more of a concern because it hasn't been the premier topic that we've been, you know, engaging in, especially in the last year and a half.
Um. I don't think that that means that it's not important to people, to us or to people on our team. And you know, a little bit of my story. I've helped start a [00:18:00] few different churches in the DC Metro area, two of which are. One's in Annapolis and there's an enormous military population that attends and then another's in Fredericksburg where we're outside of Quantico.
So we had a lot of military. So, you know, I don't, I've been to enough funerals to know that the problem that you're talking about is real. Um, I don't think that, you know, us not writing about it necessarily 'cause we don't care about it. Um. But I, at the same time, I understand your perspective on that as well.
Um,
yeah. I, my goal with, so with every organization I've ever worked for and every organization that I'm in, like I'd much rather figure out how to build bridges of burn bridges, um, [00:19:00] and. That's why, you know, I wanted to hear a little of your story and I appreciate it. I honestly know a little bit about St.
Martin, but not a ton. Um, and I took a whole bunch of notes so that I can go try to learn more. Sorry I break up there for a second.
Logan M Isaac: Oh, yeah, I can stay. I'm, I got a DHD, so I kind of hyper fixate. I'm not frozen.
Matt Murphy: No, no, no, no, no. I was frozen. I have a DHD as well, so very well, very relatable. Um.
Our, so, you know, on the legal side of things, like we, I can go back and talk to the editorial team and see about things. Our understanding from our legal team is that the articles that are up, we have, we do have rights. 'cause as rights were assigned to us by providing them to us. And that's like the copyright law doesn't allow for.[00:20:00]
Revocation of that in our, from our team's understanding that said, like if there's a solution where we don't have to lean into the, the legal side of things, then that's, you know, I'd rather like build a bridge than VER Bridge. But at the end of the day, if the only solution is taking things down, then I have to, like, we're gonna have to think through whether.
We have to think through that because it is not part of the editorial policy and from our legal team, it's not, it doesn't feel like, they don't feel like that's something that we actually are obligated to do.
Logan M Isaac: Yeah, that's fine. Um, I think the metaphor is not exactly, not accurate. Sure. On a drawbridge.
Sojourner has more power than me. Yeah. Y'all retracted. [00:21:00] When I offered stuff, it got ignored. It got declined. Um, rose was sending me stuff about distraught veterans, me and Evan Knappenberger. Like, I, I don't care what you believe, I care what the story says from the facts that I have, that I, that I have at my disposal.
Sure. Yeah. I get that. Those didn't respond to any of those emails. Um, uh. So like all I have is the facts, and you might be right. I don't know for sure, uh, but what you've given me, it does not reserve, uh, into perpetuity. Uh, I'm a member of the Author's Guild. I can ask them, but the story that this tells is a powerful organization that doesn't align with the values of a frontline laborer, an author, um, and insists on keeping them up.
And I don't know why other than to. Uh, use me as token credibility.
Matt Murphy: Yeah. I, I mean the sites that have your pages on and aren't [00:22:00] getting so much traffic, where I think that that's the concern. It's more from a, like we have editorial policies that are to maintain our credibility. It looks suspicious if we take things down and then, 'cause then that says to our audience that, um.
We don't, we publish things that we don't necessarily that or, or fully believe in. So we can
additional things that change. We can change your bio and make things unsearchable, but actually removing it from the website is a journalistic credibility with different organizations and when.
And frankly is
Logan M Isaac: outlets. You're breaking up just a little bit. I'm catching most of it, but I'm [00:23:00] closing windows too. I apologize. My computer isn't like, uh,
Matt Murphy: yeah. Let me make that. I'm on the right. A good network.
Logan M Isaac: Um. No, I, that's, that's, I understand. Um, but again, the story, yeah. The other, we get to write our own story. So if the concern on some level is that you lose credibility by removing articles that assumes that you haven't told your audience. Why those articles are there or not there? Um, I don't, I don't subscribe.
I've, I've got a business certificate from Georgetown with this veterans thing. Um, and at the end of the day, like, whose credibility are you after? Um, that, that's philosophical question. Um, the, yeah, no, uh. I was gonna say, [00:24:00] oh, I did have a, a thought. Those articles, yeah. Staying up without any kind of response or evolution or something suggests that the only, and this not just for Sojourners, but the only way, uh.
That I can only get certain articles accepted, says as much about the publishers as it does about me. For example, I wrote two articles for America Magazine. One was a, a long time ago. The other one was, uh, essentially a criticism of JD Vance for using Stolen Valor to browbeat Tim Waltz. A week after I published that.
Yeah. I discovered that Harris's campaign had [00:25:00] someone on their, no, in the vice presidential office was a guy that had been working on civil rights for soldiers and veterans with me, and I discovered that Harris. Did not implement a civil rights law for military families. When she was AG in California in 2013 and magically America said, oh, that's not an opinion piece.
We have to fact check it. They didn't have to fact check anything. When I was digging at Trump, and that sure seems like an illegal campaign, campaign violation. I told them, take that article down or publish the facts as I presented them to you, because that is engaging in an absolute prohibition on political.
Uh, activity because not long after the election, that same editor called Trump unfit to lead, and that is a bias. And because they gave me $250 to Browbeat JD Vance and essentially withheld [00:26:00] $250 for the exact opposite, that's a $500 campaign finance contribution from a nonprofit, which is illegal. So I filed an IRS complaint, and that's all I can do.
I will file a lawsuit. If I have to maintain my credibility, that will happen. Uh, I, so I, I haven't said one potential. I. Um, is to guarantee me a fill in the blank number of words where I can say some kind of update addressed to progressives or whatever you think audiences are. That updates my theology and sets this the context for what I learned writing for Sojourner.
Why I haven't written or not, I don't care. I mean, my problem is that my history with Sojourner suggests I was, I was. Not just self-censoring, I was being censored. And that in retrospect is not appropriate and not fair. That goes from wrestling with [00:27:00] demons. That goes from some of the decisions that were made about.
The newsworthiness of a ribbon. In 2011, I had a series of emails with God, Claire Lorensen, Les Denlinger Reeves, um, rose, uh, Dwayne Shank, talking about this conference that I set up at Duke that Sojourners conveniently didn't cover after I had written this stuff about Martin Luther King. So we write our own stories, whether or not
Matt Murphy: I would say, I mean that. That's, that's not unique to you. I mean, that there are dozens and dozens of writers that work for us. We can't accept all of them. And we do have issue sets that are priorities for us at different times of the organization. And, and that changes over time based on what's happening in the world. Um, that's not a, I I think you're making something personal.
That's not personal.
Logan M Isaac: We withdrew from a rock in 2011, the same year I held that conference. Why wasn't it [00:28:00] newsworthy?
Matt Murphy: I didn't say it wasn't newsworthy, but it might not have been in, in the priority set for what we were doing. We are, we're not CNN. We have a very limited staff. Right. So we have to focus in particular spaces.
Logan M Isaac: I was privileged as a writer until I started straying from a perceived party line. Yeah, you're right, but you're also not wrong. You're also not right. Sorry.
Matt Murphy: Yeah. I
Logan M Isaac: get you. Uh, you're making, and when I say you, I mean Sojourners. Yeah. Yeah. Sojourner made decisions about what to cover and what not to cover while speaking, like, uh, uh, Jim Wallace to bring up the, the kind of breakdown, he went on c Nnn and said all of these.
Priorities that prog, that Christians should agree to with Richard Land, right? Word War never fucking came out of his mouth. You know how many, how many veterans died in 2011? I fucked up. I can get into an emotional state now where. Recounting to you how fucked up it is to say that [00:29:00] war was not newsworthy in 2011.
That was the same year that Duke had all of its students for the last day of classes dress up in shirts that said the end is near with a bomb on it six months after we withdrew from Iraq. So that's, that's bias. That's civilian bias.
Matt Murphy: Okay. I, I mean, I don't, I, I disagree. Um. I think there are lots of news organizations that weren't covering war all the time.
Logan M Isaac: I think that's self evidently fucked up, that you can disagree is a luxury. I cannot, I don't share. I mean, I, it is impossible unless I pathologize my experience and say it's all in the past and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like that's unhealthy.
Matt Murphy: I understand that, but that's true with lots of issues. People that are dealing with discrimination because of their immigration status have the same situation.
They can't. Why is it a zero sum
Logan M Isaac: game?
Matt Murphy: It's, [00:30:00] I'm, there's a limited amount of resources that any organization has.
Logan M Isaac: You weren't paying me for blogging.
Matt Murphy: We also can't, like discontinued our blah.
Logan M Isaac: Uh, I'm, if something I'm saying is not true, feel free to correct me.
Matt Murphy: That is
Logan M Isaac: not a contradiction of what I just said.
It's a contextual, it's contextual that the journal got severely outweigh the benefit that I got and my community received.
Matt Murphy: Okay.
Logan M Isaac: I
Matt Murphy: mean, I think that that's subjective, but I, I understand what you're saying. Um, I. I can't, you know, I, I don't know the soldier experience. I've not experienced that. I've, many of my friends have been in that space, but I personally have not experienced that, so I can't say that.
But I do know that other people are dealing with other issues that they can't ignore, that are not being covered in every [00:31:00] news cycle.
Logan M Isaac: And, but veteran stuff is across the board not covered. So I, your friends like. That doesn't regard me. Sojourners has power. It has used that power just like anybody would.
And the way they use their power reflects their own bias. Sojourner is biased. Yeah. All If remain biased, that's fine, but leave me out of it.
Matt Murphy: All media is biased. Um.
Logan M Isaac: We're supposed to be Christian and we're supposed to turn our hearts toward the least of these. How many, I dunno. African Americans are killing themselves every day.
How many women are killing themselves every day? Like no matter how you cut it, if it's not a zero sum game, the reason that any organization has to say, we don't have time for vets, we're going to benefit from their sacrifice, while they just go ahead and kill themselves slowly, like. I dunno how else to cut it, man.
Like [00:32:00] we live in a world of not just like, what gets me about progressives is that we're worried about like some emperor anti imperialism. We live in a world where now, or we live in a country where now everybody is their own emperor. Me, me, me. Mind. Mind, mine, mine. I spent six years making sure you had those rights and now you as a civilian and Sojourner as a civilian organization, benefits off the fruit of my labor.
You know what it's called when you take the fruit of someone else's labor while watching them starve? It's slavery, and I cannot be associated with that. I will not be associated with it. I don't care what your policy is. I care that you take it down or you find some other creative solution to address the fact that my battle buddies are dying and have been, and increasingly so since I was writing for Sojourners and nothing has changed.
And instead of empowering the military community and the individuals that you were leaning on to [00:33:00] help you look like you were credible, I got jettisoned. And now you have what? Who, what's her name? Diane Westrick. I know that someday she's gonna have to grow up and she might feel bad and she might get jettisoned.
It's cyclical. So you're absolutely right. There's a lot of people with a lot of needs. So why was I treated so differently? Why is it my military service that makes it so easy to say? It's not newsworthy. It's not important. It's not you. I'm gonna sit here and receive the benefits of our democracy while the people who sacrificed for it silence themselves.
Matt Murphy: Right. Yeah, I understand what you're saying. Um, and I don't think that you, like there are other issues that we are also not covering that also warrant coverage. Um, that's, that's the reality of in, or any periodical or any journalistic organization with limited resources. [00:34:00] Yes. Has this one been one that's not covered?
You're probably right. I haven't gone through all of our archives to see what we've written about. Um, but that's equally true of many, many other issues.
Logan M Isaac: I'm not. Many other issues. I'm me and I represent a community that you are disproportionately silencing. Yeah. Yeah.
Matt Murphy: All right. Um. Yeah, I appreciate that.
I will take your thoughts and recommendations back to our editorial team and we'll be back in touch with what we think our next steps should be.
Logan M Isaac: Okay. Uh, I want to be sure I'm as explicit as possible. I'm offering to write for you for free with the proviso that not reject it, that we can have some kind of debate and back and forth with the editorial.
But you're not gonna reject it just because you got too much shit to go to do, and like too many cool kid things to do. If you're serious about supporting soldiers, I'm a [00:35:00] soldier and I don't know, you guys haven't said that. Maybe you are overtly anti-military, I don't know. But I am offering to write a piece so long as I know that I am allowed to actually speak from my voice, not from through the editorial rose colored lenses that I have been in the past.
Matt Murphy: No, I, I understand the offer that you're making and that is what I'll communicate back to our team. Um, and yeah, be in touch. What's a reasonable amount of time? I should wait, um, say Wednesday? Yeah. I mean, I would say definitely by lunch on Friday, but probably before that.
Logan M Isaac: Uh, okay. Sounds
Matt Murphy: good. Yep. I do appreciate your time and yeah, thank you for sharing.
Logan M Isaac: Sure, whoopsie. Okay, all, I'll talk to you later or I'll wait to, from you.
