📞 Michael Hoselton
This is a video transcript and audio of my April 14th call with Oregon Department of Justice employee Michael Hoselton.
Michael Hoselton: [00:00:00] Department of Justice, this is Michael. How can I help you?
Logan M. Isaac: Hi Michael, this is Logan Isaac.
Michael Hoselton: Hi, Mr. Isaac. Yeah, so I got your voicemail. Can you hear? Can you hear me okay this time?
Logan M. Isaac: I can. Thanks.
Michael Hoselton: Good. So I am the paralegal who's assigned to defend the state employees in your small claims cases. Becky's kind of our supervisor for the small claims cases.
She forwarded me the voicemail and I wanted to call you back about it. Okay. And since I have you, I wanted to talk about some things about the case. Sure. So at this point I'm still in like the. Investigation prep phase. So I'm still gathering documents and talking to people. So I only really have the very short answer to your question right now which is pretty vague.
And that is while you were at the Capitol, some people felt unsafe because of the way you were talking to them, and then they requested that OSP come and escort you [00:01:00] outta the building. And then because of that, Mr. Hanes in his capacity as the administrator. Decided to place restrictions on your access to capital.
I imagine that's probably not as satisfying as an answer as you were hoping for because it's not very detailed, at least at this point, but that's the answer I have today.
Logan M. Isaac: And Michael I didn't catch your last name when we spoke last,
Michael Hoselton: Hoselton. H-O-S-E-L-T-O-N.
Logan M. Isaac: Okay. Okay. Can you put that to me in writing?
Like it, it still feels vague and that's actually the problem. You said that people felt unsafe, so they called the cops. How is that different from like George Floyd? Like I'm asking for what it was that that I don't if it's a slight, an offense if there's some kind of thing for which they can turn to, to [00:02:00] justify.
Telling me I cannot peaceably assemble. I can't speak to my own legislator. 'cause you said public employees, and I know that Shelly Boshart Davis is paid by the state, but I wanna be really specific and clear. Like she's not an employee, she's my representative. So what is it that some things, what is it that happened?
And how does feelings, you said some people felt unsafe. I need to get specific and that's what I've been asking for from the beginning.
Michael Hoselton: And I'll try to get there. Right now I have very little documentation. I'm supposed to get some more today, so I might have a better answer for you soon. Is there a reason that for right now, I just don't know.
Logan M. Isaac: So is there a reason that Renee Perry, Shelly Boshart Davis, and or. I can see Brett Hanes thinking he's operating underneath whoever's asking for this, but Renee Perry and Shelly Boshart Davis have both refused to answer when I've asked for that [00:03:00] specific citation. And if Hanes is going to operate under good faith, like I need to know that's not just a restriction on a protected class advocating for themselves at the state capitol.
Michael Hoselton: I'll say two things to that. First you might, I'm gonna get you a more detailed answer based on the documentation I have and my communications with witnesses. But I don't know how satisfactory that might end up being, because, at the end of the day, feeling unsafe is a pretty subjective thing.
Logan M. Isaac: And I'm glad that you said that because that's really important. That's why I'm asking for specificity, like feeling, feeling unsafe is very subjective. I was in combat and people were shooting at me and I still didn't feel unsafe because I had reasonable expectation that I was in, that I was doing what I could.
But if [00:04:00] someone is saying that they feel unsafe, yeah, because I'm a veteran. I'm sorry. That's, that is federal discrimination. And I also, I had to look over the files.
Michael Hoselton: I see where you're coming from.
Logan M. Isaac: I'm sorry, say again?
Michael Hoselton: I just said I see where you're coming from. Yeah. So I think that's a reasonable point,
Logan M. Isaac: Because the state of Oregon has gotten involved and I wanted to go back over my files.
I, I may not have said in each individual case the statute that I'm suing each of them individually for. And this is gonna continue to burn through taxpayer dollars. If the state continues to shield public officials and public figures from accountability. So if you'd like that, I'm happy to give it to you because it's in my interest and the public interest to wrap this up without any more expenditures via, governor Kotek to these three private citizens.
But if you don't ask for that, then I guess we gotta go to mediation or trial or whatever. So how much would you like me to provide to you so that you don't have to do that [00:05:00] research?
Michael Hoselton: That would be great. That was actually one of the things I wanted to talk about today. Because we are planning most likely to file a motion to dismiss.
We do that in small claims cases when we think we have a good argument to do I haven't started writing it, so it's a little nebulous. And I'm not a hundred percent sure I'm gonna do it, but I think I am. And one of the reasons I was contemplating that is because your Oh, that's right. The motions.
Notices of small claims. Yeah. Yeah. So they're not they don't say the specific law. And so we can move to say you could make this more definite or certain and amend and I don't wanna waste everybody's time and especially the court's time. You're right. So let me not waste your time, Michael, you
Logan M. Isaac: Let me, let not waste your time. You filed, or Mindy filed, or whatever her name is, I can't remember. You filed a series of motions that, are you still there? Yeah. Oh, Becky. Becky. Yeah. So she filed a series of motions that are patently false line, I wanna say 19 or 20 where it says I filed against the state that is [00:06:00] demonstrably false.
The statute I filed under is Title 42, US Code Section 1983. That was also known as the Ku Klux Klan Enforcement Act of 18 71, 1 of the earliest Civil Rights Act, and it's still there. 1983. It's Section 1983.
Michael Hoselton: We get cases under section. It's 1983 all the time, but it is a federal statute. And you filed under state court?
Logan M. Isaac: No, I filed under small claims because I can't find a lawyer. And the constitutional principle of non-discrimination requires a state to see it to hear the case, unless the ORS or state statutes explicitly prohibit them. And I've already checked it doesn't, so I'll go back to what I said because you interrupted me.
You're trying. The state is trying to reach through my constitutional rights and assert supremacy over the Constitution, specifically the First Amendment, [00:07:00] and also by extension, the 14th Amendment. I have sued them. Yeah, as a private individual, the statute is "every person" to continue "shall be liable" when they do something "under color of" law.
So until the state can tell me and the rest of the residents of Oregon what that thing was, you haven't met the standard for actually establishing that there is a reasonable government interest in saying, I didn't, what did you say? I felt unsafe. So I called the cops. I'm gonna have to file a letter tomorrow instructing the judge that the state of Oregon actually cannot do that.
You can't take away my rights just because someone felt unsafe. And I've asked repeatedly in writing for what it was that, that they're basing this on. And furthermore, if it's more than simply Perry, Bosar, Davis and Hanes, then the federal. Side is gonna be very interested why there's people who are collectively conspiring to deprive [00:08:00] me of my rights, which I earned by the way, through my service, not through my birth.
I spent six years in the military and so I'm like, I'm just trying to get the thing that I was due because of my service. So I understand you'll make a motion to dismiss and I don't appreciate the threat of using the legal system against the American Combat veteran. But again, you may think that I'm here because I want to be at small claims.
Unless you or the state can pony up the cash and convince a lawyer to defend my civil rights I have nowhere else to go. Tell me where I could go. I've already extinguished my three limit three for the Oregon Bar Association. Like the state may think that it's in the right, but until you actually establish that there's some cause.
Help me see how this is in the interest of any free citizen of America.
Michael Hoselton: I'm a paralegal at the Department of Justice. I don't make policy decisions [00:09:00] or political decisions. You've filed a claim in small claims, and it's my job to defend state employees and state agencies and small claims through the small claims process. Correct.
Logan M. Isaac: And the attorney general has falsely.
Sued that I have not sued, I have not sued members of a state operating within their performance and duties, unless you're gonna say Oregon
Michael Hoselton: employee very clearly. Okay. And also, but you're defending all three. My understanding of the statute is. We also defend state officials and there's a process for that.
They requested their defense by state employees and we're defending 'em. Yeah. The state of
Logan M. Isaac: Oregon is exploiting their easy access to the courts to deprive a regular citizen of equal protection. You got that motion passed in 24 hours. You think if I submit a letter tomorrow, the judge will gimme a good answer in, in one day or less.
I don't think so. Yeah, I know. I know. This is not an equal conversation. You are a paralegal at the Department of Justice for a State of the [00:10:00] Union. I am. I'm GI Joe. Like I have been a homemaker for eight years. I can't find a job, but hey, you're right. They are using their job to disguise criminal acts, I don't know if that's the right language, but they've done something bad.
I, the DOJ is swooping in, like they're damsels in distress where the fact is somebody clutched their pearls so tight, they found their hands around someone else's neck. And that's my neck, that's my family's neck. So I'll say again, I want in writing what a specific state interest you think is applicable because according to the Supreme Court, it's gotta be pretty strict, even in a non-public forum like the government office in which it occurred.
And by the way, since it's the state of Oregon that's now inserted itself into this, I want the Oregon State police footage that Katherine Parks has declined to provide to me. And I'll email that out with Mindy. No. Becky Maile.
Michael Hoselton: Becky. Becky [00:11:00] Maile. Maile is her last name. If I could get some clarification on a few points earlier you were talking about sending a letter.
Do you mean you're gonna ask the court to reconsider the order substituting the state?
Logan M. Isaac: I'm gonna ask for my rights and equal protection. I wanna make sure that, per limited jurisdiction courts, which is the only thing that I can afford, that I'm actually given a substantial benefit of the doubt, whatever the language is in small claims, I don't know, but you've got a higher burden to cross, and yet you've already gotten a motion received and approved in under 24 hours.
So we'll see if I can get the same service.
Michael Hoselton: I'm sure the court will. Respond to anything you send to them because they're following their process, which is another thing I wanted to tell you we're following our process. That's what I meant earlier when I said, I'm a paralegal at DOJ.
I don't make [00:12:00] policy or Yeah. Respond to political things. Yeah. Michael, I have a process, but I'm Bill Connor had a process too. I'm the view of that,
Logan M. Isaac: Bull Connor had a process too. Bull Connor.
Michael Hoselton: I don't know. I don't know who that is.
Logan M. Isaac: Open on an American history book. He was the sheriff that opposed many of the black veterans from getting their rights.
So hiding behind your job may, may feel right, but like this is a state asserting an interest in depriving a combat veteran's access to equal protection. And three of the, what, five clauses of the first Amendment. So when can I expect in writing? I am happy. Let me put it this way. I will withdraw my complaint if I see that the state has provided, or the plaintiffs have provided substantive claims to the interest or claiming what it is that I did because having a loud voice and being intense because I have a DHD, I'm sorry, you're gonna cut a lot of people out of political due process.[00:13:00]
When can I expect that?
Michael Hoselton: I said earlier after I've done my investigation and gotten all the documents from my clients and the state agencies involved I would be happy to tell you with as much specificity as I have what the basis was for calling Oregon State Police on you. And what about the footage to the body cam?
Yeah. Yeah, as to that my understanding is that OSP denied your public records request because apparently there's a state law or policy that says they don't have to give out body cams or public records request. Now that we're in litigation. There is a process called Discovery where it's not open in small claims.
It's not available to me. Michael, that's correct. Because you've chosen to do it in small claims. I don't have a choice, which is another, I can say it again. Why? Ask you about, 'cause you could go to a civil court [00:14:00] or the regular circuit court the small claims, as as a division within the circuit court, that's meant to make it easier for people without attorneys to deal with simple claims under 10. Why $10,000?
Logan M. Isaac: Why would I choose something that's less easy? Why would I do that? Why would you do that?
Michael Hoselton: For one, you'd get discovery. If you wanna Yeah, I'm get the body cam. That would be, that would open up that process.
Logan M. Isaac: Understand you would choose that, but that is not a choice available to me. I've already described how that's not something that
Michael Hoselton: well other people do it.
Logan M. Isaac: I'm not other people, Michael. I'm just me.
Michael Hoselton: That's true. You make your choices.
Logan M. Isaac: That's right. Yeah. I've already, I thought I explained that, but Okay.
Michael Hoselton: You did. I just, I guess I'm disagreeing with your characterization that's off the table, procedurally speaking.
Logan M. Isaac: Oh yeah. I'm not just a procedure. I'm a human being.
Michael Hoselton: You have about how you want this do.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah. Michael, I'm not the DOJ, I don't have a procedure. I am Logan Isaac, like whatever you think I'm supposed to [00:15:00] choose.
Michael Hoselton: No, the court. If I could just explain what I mean there. The court has avenues that you can use and you've chosen to use small claims and small claims.
Logan M. Isaac: And you don't trust it's a morally competent decision.
Michael Hoselton: And the state I'm not bringing anything about moral competence into what I'm saying. What I'm saying is.
Logan M. Isaac: Then why're you questioning my decision? Why can't you just let it go?
Michael Hoselton: And there's different I didn't really mean I to question your decision.
Logan M. Isaac: But that's literally what you're doing.
Michael Hoselton: I would really characterize with that what
Logan M. Isaac: You're literally questioned whether or not you question why I chose by suggesting there are other options that I didn't and should have taken. You are, it clearly insinuated I'm that you don't trust my choice.
Michael Hoselton: Could have done.
Logan M. Isaac: So. The question is answered. What is, what else do you have for me Michael? You had some other questions.
Michael Hoselton: I want to go back to talking about this potential motion to dismiss.
Logan M. Isaac: Okay. [00:16:00] Go for it.
Michael Hoselton: And so there's a few issues that I wanted to ask you about because like I said, if it's just something like you might amend your claim to be more specific.
We don't wanna waste the court's time if we don't have to. 'cause you have the right to amend your claim if you want to. And I wanted to know in your allegations, are you saying that you have any economic damages? Do you unders, do you know, are you familiar with the distinction between economic and non-economic damages? I know those are legal terms.
Logan M. Isaac: I, I don't have time to go over them. Now if, do you have a question for me or what's, but
Michael Hoselton: I, I'm questioning, are you saying that you have economic damages and in your claim, are you asking the court to give you money for economic damages?
Logan M. Isaac: My claim has already been filed; you've seen it.
Michael Hoselton: I know, but I think it's unclear on that point, which is why I'm asking you. 'cause if you're not seeking economic damages, that might be something that we do a motion to dismiss on. But if you have economic damages and you can be more clear, [00:17:00] then you might want to do that so that I don't file a motion and you just say I meant this, but I need to change it.
Does that make sense?
Logan M. Isaac: Point taken. What else?
Michael Hoselton: So you, you don't okay. You don't have to answer that question if you don't want to. The other question I had is similar. So there's a thing called injunctive relief, and that isn't about money. That's when you're asking a judge to order something or to make some kind of ruling.
And since you're talking in your claims about how you alleged that your civil rights have been violated and your first amendment rights curtailed, I'm wondering, are you asking the small claims judge to order the state or any state employee or any elected official to do something? Are you se purely just seeking money in this claim?
Logan M. Isaac: Is that how you read my complaint; that I'm just seeking money?
Michael Hoselton: Actually no, I didn't.
Logan M. Isaac: Oh good. So you have your [00:18:00] answer.
Michael Hoselton: I thought it was ambiguous. I thought it implied that maybe you wanted injunctive relief, but I wasn't sure, which is why I'm asking answer. And the other reason why I'm asking is I don't believe small claims lets you do injunctive relief.
So that would be an issue that would have come up in a potential motion to dismiss. And that's another thing where, you might wanna change it. And then we could. Save the court judicial time.
Logan M. Isaac: Point taken.
Michael Hoselton: But again, you don't have to answer if you don't want to.
Logan M. Isaac: Oh, I thought I had. Anything else?
Michael Hoselton: I didn't understand that it, that the answer to my question, but.
Logan M. Isaac: You need to restate it so I can answer it specifically.
Michael Hoselton: Are you asking for injunctive relief?
Logan M. Isaac: Does my complaint say that?
Michael Hoselton: No.
Logan M. Isaac: There's your answer.
Michael Hoselton: It maybe imp implied that. Okay. So you're not.
Logan M. Isaac: You got your answer.[00:19:00]
Michael Hoselton: Okay. And so your complaint didn't have any exhibits or other evidence attached to it, which is fine. I don't believe it has to. But since it doesn't, that means there's things that we won't know until we go to trial because we don't have discovery. I can't ask you to give me anything beforehand.
So just FYI, if we do go to trial, we will send you a letter that kind of serves as like a trial memo that will tell you the arguments that we're gonna make in the exhibits we plan to offer. We do that 'cause we're. We tend to be pretty cordial in the legal industry and we try to make things easy for people in small claims too.
Is that, yeah. But one of my questions was so you know the limit is 10,000, but I'm wondering, 'cause it seems like you consider this probably worth more. Do you, are you asking for 10,000 because you think that's how much damages you're entitled to? Or are you asking that for that because that's just the limit.
Logan M. Isaac: What does my complaint [00:20:00] say?
Michael Hoselton: It just says 10,000, but it doesn't say how you came to 10,000.
Logan M. Isaac: Oh, okay. You already have your answer.
Michael Hoselton: Is that another thing you don't want to answer?
Logan M. Isaac: I've given you the answer. It's in the form of the complaint. Everything that you've asked me can be answered in the complaint. What I've asked for you from is what I've been waiting from your clients for, I don't know, a couple months.
Which I don't have. So things would be a little bit more equal when I know that there's actually some reasonable, relatively limited government interest that they think justifies all this.
Michael Hoselton: And when you say limited government interest, are you talking about or standing to ask the court to substitute the state as the defendant, or are you talking about the restriction on your access to the capital?
Logan M. Isaac: I've only ever been [00:21:00] asking about access to the capital because I've got a bill on this in the chamber now, and they're keeping me from the chamber. It seems like you're trying to, the state now, is trying to obstruct a federally protected class from self-determination. So you have, I'd love to know.
I've been asking, I never would've filed a complaint if they'd given me something to go off of, but they, we've got the federal level trying to unify the executive, and we got the states trying to shield their own elected representatives from accountability.
Michael Hoselton: Well, I think it's fair to say that we would dispute that characterization. Your restrictions on the capital. My understanding is you can still go to hearings if you check in with the state troopers first, and I don't believe you've been restricted from calling or emailing or writing anyone.
Logan M. Isaac: First Amendment says "abridged." That's a pretty basic threshold. If you want to abridge my [00:22:00] rights, you have to tell me why. None of your clients have told me why.
Michael Hoselton: I can't get more specific with you right now, as I've said before, than people felt unsafe and they called for a trooper. Yeah, intervene.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah, it sounds like a "damsel in distress." Yeah, I get it.
Michael Hoselton: Yeah, I'm aware you did.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah. I, you I have audio, some audio from the interaction, and I know each of your clients have access to that, whether they've listened to it is up to them. But again, this is, this creates a, an ever increasing burden on each of your clients to explain why they used state power to deprive a combat veteran of their civil rights as a protected class.
So if small claims is supposed to use a pretty low bar, that's a pretty high bar for the state of Oregon. Since you guys want to insert yourself to say that you get that you're entitled to withdraw, [00:23:00] fundamental American Rights just because of some feelings.
Is that what you said? If they felt afraid or they felt unsafe. That's just.
Michael Hoselton: I'm told people felt unsafe, and when people that's feel unsafe, sometimes they ask for the police. Yeah. And it's subjective.
Logan M. Isaac: It is, people get killed all the time by [pearl clutching]. Yeah.
Michael Hoselton: They not make them available.
Logan M. Isaac: You say subjective, I say deadly.
Michael Hoselton: I don't understand what you mean by deadly.
Logan M. Isaac: People felt unsafe and so they called the police on George Floyd. That meets your level of subjective, but it would also be proper and correct to say that [feelings] can also be deadly. Feelings can be deadly. If Renee Perry was afraid, why did I walk out of that office on good terms with [District 15 Policy Director Dru Draper]?
Why did I get followed by officer Brian Colacz to Manning's office, where I also had a conversation with his. Him as a witness, and again, footage was withheld. So you have a really high bar to establish that [00:24:00] those feelings of fear are reasonable and don't interfere with the regular, normal exercise of my political determination.
Why did Renee feel unsafe? When will you or someone tell me what it was, not "subjective." Give me something more. And the, I can't believe that [Governor Tina Kotek] is already burning taxpayer dollars, employing the Department of Justice, and they haven't even heard what the thing is that made all these feelings come up in people.
That just seems like a waste of taxpayer money. And strikes me as a political, hot potato. 'cause Kotek wants to stay under the radar in this administration, but this is gonna throw it front and center. A progressive state wants to deprive a combat veteran of their first and 14th amendment rights.
Let me say that again. A blue state under Trump wants to take away a right that was asserted by a decorated [00:25:00] combat, a hundred percent disabled veteran. Is that what you want the headlines to be? Because Oregon inserted themselves, they didn't have to. I'll say again. I sued Ray Renee Perry, Shelly Boshart Davis, and Brett Hanes as private citizens because they took a private interest in their feelings or whatever the heck it is that's "subjective," and they tried to take away my rights. You're right, I could go to the federal district court. I can't afford it. And that's not just a money issue. Michael. I don't have however many millions of dollars that the Department of Justice has. I dunno, maybe it's billions. I have no idea.
I've got two kids and no job. So don't like, it's really insulting to tell me that you have a process and you're following it. I'm sorry. I can read and I read history and I read law. That is going to be the headline. If it gets out that
Tina Kotek empowered her attorney general to go after the rights, the fundamental civil rights, of a disabled combat veteran, that is a fact.[00:26:00]
Like we can argue about subjective interpretation, can't we, Michael? But that is a fact.
Michael Hoselton: We would, I think it's pretty safe to say we would not agree with that characterization of what's.
Logan M. Isaac: You just said. You didn't have all the information
Michael Hoselton: pertain to the department. That's true. I'm still gathering information. I meant the part where you were saying quite a bit about the Governor's and Attorney General's decision to defend this case. We're following,
Logan M. Isaac: I know the Attorney General was served.
Michael Hoselton: We defend state employees and officials and agencies that. That's my full-time job.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah, man, I would love a job.
Michael Hoselton: Small space as it's part of that job.
Logan M. Isaac: Would the DOJ give me a job, Michael?
Michael Hoselton: A good job. It pays well.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah, man, I love that. I wish I had that.
Michael Hoselton: I'm for hiring decisions, but if you're the most qualified candidate who applies, then that's how that process works. That's how I got my job.
Logan M. Isaac: Jesus, man. Let me know when you have some kind of concrete, [00:27:00] you know it, it can be subjective, but someone's gotta say what exactly happened that rose to the level of depriving me of my rights. Nobody said that. Not in any communication with Renee Perry, Shelly Boshart Davis, or Brett Hanes, formally or informally. That looks really suspicious. It looks like they're hiding behind the state to disguise their violation of the KKK Act.
This is, these are all just facts or No, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. The KKK act is a fact. It is a valid interpretation to take that the Department of Justice of Oregon, which operates under the direction of the governor, like the Attorney General was served. That is a fact. And then the Attorney General or someone below them decided to defend a private citizen who abused their access to the power that you've already stated the DOJ has. You guys chose to intervene. If you choose to continue intervening, I am going to ask, and I'm gonna continue [00:28:00] to ask for "what is the interest?" What crime, statute, regulation was violated? Nobody has said that, and that I think is a grave underestimation of the stakes on the part of the state of Oregon. But here we are.
Michael Hoselton: I have to ask just one more time. Are you saying that DOJ's participation in this is unlawful or are you talking just about what's in your claim? I'm just trying to understand if you're raising a new thing.
Logan M. Isaac: I don't think no. Why would you think I'm raising a new thing?
Michael Hoselton: It sounded like you were saying that the Department of Justice was unlawfully inserting itself into misconduct by a state employee.
Logan M. Isaac: If you haven't done your re-
Michael Hoselton: Did I miss? Did I miss you? Again?
Logan M. Isaac: If you don't know the answers to some of these questions, it means someone hasn't done their due diligence. That doesn't absolve you [00:29:00] of the responsibility to do it. So that the department, the DOJ, and ostensibly the state of Oregon, the State of Oregon, hasn't done their due diligence.
They've paid with taxpayer money to file motions in court without getting to the facts. You've already told me that you don't know why. Other than that, some people "felt scared." like that, that does not meet the, what was it, the standard, I can't remember what it's called. I think so you're a third party.
Michael Hoselton: I think misunderstood. We're in the process of gathering documents. Me personally. It does take time to get them.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah. You're not hearing me, man.
Michael Hoselton: Because I'm not a wizard, I have to read your complaint. I have to investigate it. I have to send out document requests. I have to, yeah. Wait for other people to get me those documents back. It takes time. It took time just for us to become aware of your complaint. Because there's a processing time.
Logan M. Isaac: Yeah those a processes that aren't open to me.
Michael Hoselton: Resources are not unlimited.
Logan M. Isaac: Do you [00:30:00] have any other specific questions? 'cause I'm trying to remember I'm the lawyer and you're also the lawyer and like I, but there's a third part, if you don't know, but you've already taken action, that's a problem.
Now I don't know that legal, social, more, I don't care. Like the state of Oregon has already taken action without knowing all the facts and that's going to create some blowback if you're not careful.
Michael Hoselton: I, I think maybe you're misunderstanding what we filed. These are kind of procedural motions, not factual motions. They're standard things we do in these cases; substitute into the individual defendant. When we file the motion to dismiss, that's not gonna be done if we file one. 'cause we might not. If we do that, it's gonna be based on our best understanding of the facts and the law.
And if we go to trial, that's also going to be at a time when we can tell the court we're prepared to do it. Because we have, we know what's going on at this point in the [00:31:00] process, but we're at the beginning of. The process. We don't normally have these kind of extended discussions, but I am happy to talk with you.
There, there was one more thing I wanna was on my list to ask you and I'm gonna ask it, but I'm pretty sure it's a pointless question at this point. You mentioned mediation settlement is theoretically an option. I don't know if the state would agree to that at this point. But I'm wondering if you wanted to make a settlement, would you have an initial offer or do you just wanna go to trial?
It's up to you. I don't have an offer at this point, and if you wanted to go to mediation I'm not authorized to say yes or no to that now. But if you do want to do that, I'll go to my clients and say, do you think we should do mediation? And if they agree, then you know, we can ask the court to do that.
Logan M. Isaac: It's my understanding and I'm not a lawyer, that Oregon small claims require mediation. That is why I mentioned it. [00:32:00] Without checking my notes. I do not know if it's true.
Michael Hoselton: I know mediation is an option. I don't know if it's mandatory off the top of my head.
Logan M. Isaac: Okay.
Michael Hoselton: If you wanna mediate and my client agrees to it I'm happy to do that. It's just we wanna make sure it would be productive. And after talking with you, I'm not sure if we can get to a meeting of the minds, because what happens in mediation is we talk to the judge. You talk to the judge, we all talk together, we try to find a reasonable compromise, and I'm not sure we can get there. Based on what we've talked about so far.
Logan M. Isaac: That was a statement.
Michael Hoselton: It was a statement following the question, and the question was, are you interested in settlement and are you interested in potentially mediating instead of going to trial?
Logan M. Isaac: I'm open to all options, but I'm taking them to [00:33:00] court because they refuse to give me footage and they refuse to provide any evidence that something actually happened.
Michael Hoselton: So if, okay, now that we're in the small claims process, the evidence would come at trial or attached to emotion.
Logan M. Isaac: Okay. And what prevented them from sharing that from before? Would that not fall under the performance in of their duties?
Michael Hoselton: I can't speak to that because I don't have their jobs.
Logan M. Isaac: Oh, okay.
Michael Hoselton: But I do know that Mr. Hanes sent you a letter. Apparently Ms. Boshart Davis sent you a letter to I haven't seen her letter.
Logan M. Isaac: It's online. You can find it at gi justice.com/record.
Michael Hoselton: I will look there. I looked at one of your websites and I didn't see it, but maybe I missed it.
Logan M. Isaac: Why haven't they provided that to you?
Michael Hoselton: They're working on it.
Logan M. Isaac: They're [00:34:00] work. They sent it. Oh my God.
Michael Hoselton: I think that I'm still waiting to get documents from my [employer].
Logan M. Isaac: Yep. Yep.
Michael Hoselton: Anyway, that's all the questions I had. Did you have any questions for me that you haven't had the chance to ask yet?
Logan M. Isaac: Not that I can expect an answer on.
Michael Hoselton: Okay, then I guess we're done for today. If I am able to fill him up with a clear articulable reason that I think you would be happy with on. Investigation and talking with witnesses, then I'd be happy to talk with you again and see if that makes you happy and you're willing to dismiss.
Logan M. Isaac: Hey, michael, how do I just wanna make sure I got your last name spelled right. H-O-S-E-L-T-O-N.
Michael Hoselton: That's right.
Logan M. Isaac: Okay, awesome. Okay.
Michael Hoselton: Alright, have a good day Mr. Isaac.
