20251211 OR Public Utilities Commission

OR PUC: [00:00:00] If you wanted any further and you wanted to dispute that you called in, then you would have, it would be a civil matter and you would get a lawyer for that. 

Logan M Isaac: Could you repeat what you just said? I didn't quite catch it and I wanna make sure I've got it on record. So you went to [Pacific Power]. 

OR PUC: So the Public Utility Commission goes to the corporate office of the utility when a customer files a complaint and then we work with what's called a regulatory liaison. They're the people that work in the corporate office specifically with regulatory issues. We ask them specific questions about the complaint and we ask them to review the records. Um, and then when they come back to us, they tell us what the records indicate.

And then we relay that back to the customer whether or not there was any mistake or anything that could be done on our side. In this particular instance, [00:01:00] their records clearly show that you requested to have it activated in July. You called back in September, requested to have it disconnected, and then right now the service is technically still active, but it doesn't have a signer.

But if the service is being used and they can prove that the service is being used by you, even if there wasn't a signer during that time, you would, would be liable for those charges. Um, so what I'm saying is that if you feel that they don't have records proving that you called in and requested the activation of the service, then you would go to a lawyer, it would become a civil matter.

Logan M Isaac: Um, and could I get your name again? I, I don't think I wrote it down. 

OR PUC: Yeah. My name is Kim KIM, 

Logan M Isaac: from the Public Utilities Commission of Oregon. Or is this federal?

OR PUC: Correct. No, it's, it's the state. [00:02:00] 

Logan M Isaac: So I just wanna reiterate what you said to me to make sure I understand it right. You asked them, fill in the blank, they said they had a record and you took 'em at their word.

OR PUC: That is how it works. Yes, because they would be in a lot of trouble if they didn't give us the correct information. 

Logan M Isaac: How would they be in trouble if you just take...

OR PUC: Because you're the regulatory agency. 

Logan M Isaac: How would they be in trouble if you just take them at their word? 

OR PUC: So, um, in the 12 years that I've been working here, I have yet to have them lie to me about a case because they have no benefit to that if they were to lie to me and it's in public record. So all of this information that I'm giving you is also part of your case, which is public record. Part of 

Logan M Isaac: my what,

OR PUC: which is it's, it's part of your case. 

Logan M Isaac: My case.

OR PUC: As in your complaint record. 

Logan M Isaac: Do you have a case number that you can email to me in response to the email I sent you? I've got customers outside. I have to close the door. We don't to take this call.

OR PUC: We don't, we don't. [00:03:00] We don't have case numbers. It's just under your name. 

Logan M Isaac: So you just take a public utility at their word. You do not create reference or case numbers. And the burden of proof is on the consumer. 

OR PUC: It's not a case number, it's under. Sir, we don't have to have a case number. We, I'm looking at your case right now. We don't give them numbers. They're all done by name.

Logan M Isaac: By name, okay.

OR PUC: And then when we pull up the case record, it has everything in it. Okay. And if they were to lie to us and then you said, I'm not gonna take them at their word, and I'm gonna take you to court for this. You would be able to take this case record, which is public record, and anybody can get it if they request it, and they would have to prove that they did not lie to the utility Commission. But. I have yet to see that happen in 12 years.

Logan M Isaac: Kim, this is called Circular Logic. You as a

OR PUC: Okay.

Logan M Isaac: As a, well, just a second. I tried not to interrupt you. I need to make sure [00:04:00] this is on record. A public utility commission slash enforcement or not, maybe not enforcement, but accountability, I guess you're taking them at their word. They said they had a record. I've disputed that record and it's up to me to take them to court. They claim I have a thousand dollars in UN in provided services. They have no written contract and they have refused to provide any kind of evidence. Or documentation.

OR PUC: There is no written contract.

Logan M Isaac: Well, wait, wait, wait, wait.

OR PUC: There is no written contract.

Logan M Isaac: I, I hear you laughing and that's really frustrating as a consumer.

OR PUC: I'm laughing. I'm, I'm kind of giggling a little bit because there is no written contract.

Logan M Isaac: Right, so.

OR PUC: You know that because all you have to do is call them and request the services be activated.

Logan M Isaac: Right.

OR PUC: When you give all of your information, you give your business information.

Logan M Isaac: So, Kim, I'm gonna stop you because you've interrupted me again. I dispute the fact that [00:05:00] I said anything that they've claimed that I've said on whatever July 1st. I've got them on a recorded phone line as I do with you now, giving me two different dates, shifting their explanations, and all of that is public record because I put it on the internet. And you are taking a public utility at their word en forcing the burden of proof on the consumer, which is in violation of multiple tort laws at the federal level and state level, as well as federal pr consumer protection laws. So, because you have refused to communicate to me in writing, and I have to record this, and I'm losing business as I do this, this may constitute, excuse me, Kim, I, can you excuse me, Kim? I can, excuse me.

OR PUC: I'm sorry. I, I'm not refusing to give you anything in writing. I'm not refusing that I ordered.

Logan M Isaac: Okay, so put it in writing.

OR PUC: Copy of the case record. Record.

Logan M Isaac: You acknowledge that you got my email. I'll wait for your email in return. 

OR PUC: Okay? I will email you the case record. 

Logan M Isaac: The case that doesn't exist, but by my name. Is that [00:06:00] correct? 

OR PUC: The case is listed under the business's name and then it has your name listed as well. 

Logan M Isaac: Okay. I'll look forward to getting this in writing because I can't keep losing business, taking phone calls, defending myself against a public utility.

OR PUC: No problem. I will send it out for, I will, you'll have it by tomorrow morning. Okay? 

Logan M Isaac: An email? 

OR PUC: Yes. 

Logan M Isaac: Okay. Sure. Takes a lot of time, I guess, to write an email. Sure. 

OR PUC: Well, I, unfortunately, I do have a lot of other things that I have to do, so I apologize.

Logan M Isaac: You're on the clock. I assume you're getting paid. You're not volunteering. So the fact that you have a bunch of stuff going on is not my responsibility. I'm sorry you don't understand how contracts and torts work, but this is case, common law. It's it's established in law.

OR PUC: Thank you, Logan. Thank you so much. I will make sure to get this back to you as soon as I, as I can, okay?

Logan M Isaac: Okay. I look forward to not losing any more business, defending myself. 

OR PUC: All right. Thank you, Logan. Bye-bye 

Logan M Isaac: [00:07:00] Bye.